The Trailblazers Experience Podcast

EP52 Melanie Smallwood: My C-Suite Journey Navigating E-commerce & Sustainable Fashion Leadership

• Ntola • Season 3 • Episode 52

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EP52 My next guest  features Melanie Smallwood, the inspiring Group Chief Commercial and Brand Partnerships Officer at the Global Fashion Group

Ever wondered how resilience and determination can shape a stellar career in the fashion industry?
From her humble beginnings on the shop floor at Harrods to her strategic move to Harvey Nichols in Saudi Arabia, Melanie shares the remarkable journey that propelled her to the forefront of the e-commerce world with eBay. Gain insights into her unique career path, her innovative transition into the digital space, and the invaluable lessons she learned about balancing professional growth with family life.

Chapters
00:00  Career Journey of Melanie Smallwood
11:57 Building High-Energy, Productive Teams
22:23  Empowering Women in Leadership
33:30  Adapting Fashion Industry to Sustainability
43:11  Balancing Career and Family Priorities
56:56  Trailblazer Takeaway Tips for Success


Melanie also dives into the art of building high-energy, productive teams. She discusses the blend of academic intelligence and entrepreneurial spirit required to drive commercial excellence, emphasizing that traditional educational backgrounds are not the only path to success. With personal anecdotes, she highlights the importance of resilience, inclusivity, and leadership adaptability to cater to diverse cultural and individual needs. Discover her strategies for fostering an innovative environment where team members are encouraged to take risks and learn from failures.

Finally, explore the evolving landscape of the fashion industry with a focus on sustainability and ethical consumption. Melanie shares how the Global Fashion Group stays ahead with agile and customer-centric approaches, pioneering sustainable practices, and managing the delicate balance between a demanding career and personal life. Listen to her heartfelt reflections on setting boundaries and investing in family well-being. Melanie’s trailblazer takeaway tips for success – kindness, humility, and persistence – offer a treasure trove of wisdom for aspiring leaders and anyone looking to achieve fulfilment in both their professional and personal lives.

Find Melanie
 Linkedin        uk.linkedin.com/in/melaniesmallwood
Instagram    melaniesmallwood.co.uk

Listen : to the audio version Apple Spotify .Amazon Music Google Podcasts
Watch and subscribe to my YouTube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@Thetrailblazersexperience
Follow Instagram : https://www.instagram.com/thetrailblazersexperience/

The Trailblazers Experience :

Welcome to the Trailblazers Experience podcast, the podcast where we have candid conversations with women sharing their career journeys. My next guest today super excited is Melanie Smallwood, and here's a brief intro to this amazing Trailblazer Blazer. She's currently the Group Chief, commercial and Brand Partnerships Officer at the Global Fashion Group, which operates in 12 countries. It is a publicly listed company I was looking at the financials so this is a big group and is considered the leading fashion and lifestyle destination in growth markets across Latin America, southeast Asia, australia and New Zealand. The company operates three e-commerce platforms connecting over 12 million customers. Melanie, how are you?

Melanie Smallwood:

Good morning. Thank you, Natalia. A pleasure to meet you and thank you very much for the kind invitation. I'm delighted to be here.

The Trailblazers Experience :

I'm really excited to have this conversation with you because it's been such a dynamic and colourful career journey and definitely worth telling, because we need to have these stories being shared, being told to inspire the next generation of leaders as well.

Melanie Smallwood:

It's definitely been a journey and I think growth is a really important part of my journey, from both a personal and a professional level, and I started my journey pretty young. So, talking about the next gen and how they navigate this very complex environment that we're living in today, I started when I was in my early 20s and I led from the front in the sense that my entire family had been in fashion and I said this is something I love, this is what I want to do. I didn't necessarily have the educational background that led me through graduate programs, so I had to fight quite hard to make myself present and known in the companies that I was working for, and I joined Harrods in my early days, which at that time was really the most you know for running luxury department store business in the UK not global, but definitely a leading business and I remember very clearly joining on the shop floor, being told that you know I had to work my way up, that there was no natural kind of entry into being a buyer, which is effectively what I wanted to do, and I was there for from the very early days. I ended up being there for 14 years and what I would say is knowing what you want to do and what you're passionate about is really fundamental to being successful. And I loved fashion, I loved product, I loved luxury. And I loved fashion, I loved product, I loved luxury.

Melanie Smallwood:

So I landed in Harrods and basically was very persistent in my pursuit of the job that I wanted. There was a very incredible leader in Har her office and say this is what I want to do, tell me how I get there. And she would say go away, learn this, do this, deliver this, and then I will think about your next steps. So it took a time. I think within the first 18 months I was given my first assistant buyer role in the international designer room, which was beautiful, and it just went from there. And I think delivering value, being myself, being who I was, made a huge difference for me and Harrods, in an environment where I was, you know, educationally, probably behind a number of my peers, demonstrating my passion and my enthusiasm and my focus for the business, really ended up with me being GM, and that took time. But I, you know, had a fantastic life at Harrods and a fantastic career and then, after 14 years, it was a little bit like what now? What do I do. Now I can do this, I've nailed it, I can. You know, it's very familiar, it's very easy, and one of my personal characteristics has always been never to stand still, to constantly seek to learn, to constantly develop, to constantly grow.

Melanie Smallwood:

And so I left Harrods, which was a really tough decision because I didn't have another job to go to, which is not something I would ever recommend, by the way, for our next gen. And a friend of mine was running Harvey Nichols in London and she said look, hey, we've got an issue in Saudi. We have a license in Saudi Arabia, in Riyadh, and we need somebody to go and fix the business Riyadh and we need somebody to go and fix the business. So I thought, great, similar product, similar positioning, slightly younger consumer. It gives me an opportunity to develop international as a skill set. It was another layer on top of what I'd already learned, and so I said, sure, I'll go to Riyadh.

Melanie Smallwood:

I hadn't really thought too much about the environment and some of the limitations that existed in that time.

Melanie Smallwood:

And I got on a plane and I flew to Riyadh to meet the teams locally and what I saw was just a huge opportunity for transformation, a huge opportunity for growth.

Melanie Smallwood:

I was able to leverage my relationships and my industry network to really turn the business upside down and inside out. Because of the local laws, I couldn't live in Riyadh, so I spent a lot of my time commuting, had a team that was very dispersed around the globe, so buyers in New York, buyers in Milan, buyers in Paris, all trying to fundamentally cobble together a strategy that delivered this business back to growth. And I did that for five years. I had two kids in the process, so really juggling there was no work-life balance, if I'm honest at that time, but juggling the balance of travel and kids and family commitments. And after five years I realized that actually my kids needed me to be more present and so I left and I came back and started looking for what's next and I'd done luxury, I added international to my remit and then it was like, well, actually the industry is growing, but where is it growing? And it was growing in e-com at that time and luxury wasn't really the place where e-com was developing at a fast pace.

Melanie Smallwood:

So somebody approached me from eBay and said hey, we'd love to talk to you about a role running our fashion business in Germany and the UK. And my immediate response was this just doesn't make sense for me in terms of career path. I love beautiful product, I love luxury. And then I sat down and thought about it and thought actually of development opportunity. Ebay's a 70 billion dollar business. It's a different consumer, a different fashion position, but I can learn an incredible amount from this business and these people. And so I took the job and all my fashion friends were like hey, you're, why are you doing that? It doesn't make sense, the deviation is too extreme.

Melanie Smallwood:

But what I realized was I was adding another very important skill set for my future into the mix, which at the time, there were a lot of industry leaders like me that had followed a similar path, and so I was like how do I build my own USP, how do I make myself more employable? And that was by diversification through my skill set. So I joined eBay, did eBay for five years. You know you're looking at 16 million products which are hard to curate. It's not luxury, it's really mainstream. It's not luxury, it's really mainstream. So I added another expansion of assortment and expansion of brand understanding to my luxury mandate and did that for five years and I dug in to everything. I stuck my nose into every project, every SEO team project, every mobile development project, every tech project, and I just learned. I invested a lot of time in learning and making myself available to support on loads of other things.

Melanie Smallwood:

So that was the journey and eBay led me to where I am today, which is probably my best job ever, I think in my entire career journey. It's the job I love the most, it's the job I'm most passionate about, and Global Fashion Group, as you said, is 12 countries, 12 businesses effectively with very local nuances, different customers, different teams, huge diversity and a significant opportunity to grow because of the markets where we're operating. They're very early days in their e-commerce journey, so huge amount of opportunity to deliver value and that's. I've been with this business for eight years eight years and three months and I'm still learning and I'm still growing and I'm still building my USP and I have incredible teams and I'm able to develop incredible teams globally and locally, and that's a really important part of me as a leader and giving back. So that's where I am today in terms of journey and how I got there.

The Trailblazers Experience :

I mean Melanie.

The Trailblazers Experience :

Now let us just pause and thank you very much for just running through that, because I think it was really important to hear it that way. The whole idea of working from the ground up and grafting on the shop floor to rise in positions is something that can still happen, and I think it just shouldn't take away from the fact that not everyone's going to go to university, not everyone's going to go to college, not everyone's going to get into an amazing graduate program, and there are still opportunities within an organization or in fashion or in retail, to start from the ground up, whether it's on the shop floor, then become a cashier, then be the department lead, et cetera. It's just, your career has been marked by consistency, being open to learn, being curious, continuous development and also being patient, because it's taken time. You've just said 12 years, then you said five, then another five, then eight. You know instant gratification wasn't part of the plan. It was hard graft, great consistency, and I think that's important to highlight as well that that's also an important career journey path. It does exist.

Melanie Smallwood:

Yeah, and I think hard work and persistence and resilience are really key, whether you go through and I have a 21-year-old daughter who's just graduated right, I've advocated for that for her because I didn't have the opportunity because of my family circumstances and I've not advocated for that because I think she stands a better chance of getting a great job. I've advocated for that because it gives her a foundation upon which she can build and I think that you know, my career took a lot of time and it took a lot of determination and there were a lot of points where you go, man, if I had a degree, would I be accelerating faster? But the reality also is that you know, academic smart and business smart are two different things. There's a lot of kids that are academic, that can have photographic memories, that can repurpose and resurface a narrative very easily, and then there are the kids, like I was, who are business savvy and business smart and see the opportunity and the way I think and I have graduates in my team right. So I'm a really strong believer. If that's your path, that's what works for you.

Melanie Smallwood:

But my graduates sometimes don't think out of the box. You know, it's a different. It's a brilliant thought process. I'm a little bit more. You know, if we can't do it this way, how can we do it? It's more problem solution based.

Melanie Smallwood:

So I think there's such a good synergy between both skill sets and educational parts and I think it's just important to know for the generation that if you don't have a degree, you can still be really successful in your chosen field.

Melanie Smallwood:

And I think more and more businesses and companies are not simply ticking boxes with degrees anymore. They're actually looking for people who are more entrepreneurial, looking for people with additional skill sets. So I think it's not quite, as you know, back in the day when I was trying to get into fashion, quite as you know, back in the day when I was trying to get into fashion, lvmh would not even interview me because I didn't have a degree and that's you know. That's an educational discrimination in my opinion, and one that I was very determined to still do what I wanted to do. And if I couldn't do it with them, I'll find a company that was a little bit more flexible and open. So I think for anyone, if you focus on an ambition and a goal and you're passionate about what you do, how you get there is kind of academic at this point.

The Trailblazers Experience :

Yeah, and it's just music to my ears because, in terms of my background and how I started, I started on the shop floor of the intertext group at the time and my circumstances meant I couldn't go to university, so I'm literally entrepreneurial commercial acumen from the ground up. It's only now, 20, 25 years later, that I managed then to finish my degree remotely just because I just wanted to have it. Then to finish my degree remotely just because I just wanted to have it. But really it's been that commercial acumen understanding, problem solving, building relationships, working with people is what have sort of been the and open to new channels. You talked about how you started off in fashion department stores and then going on to international markets and then building on to e-commerce, which wasn't sexy 15 years ago. Who?

The Trailblazers Experience :

are those digital people Exactly and just coming full circle. So it's really good to show that the tapestry of life I think, like you said, is just being open and the resilience. So, melanie, talk to me about. You're a business leader and you've talked about working with different teams. How do you build brilliant teams to drive commercial excellence now that you're at the helm of your career?

Melanie Smallwood:

Now you know that fundamentally, I have a belief that businesses are only successful because of people, whether that be your customer or whether that be your employees, and my leadership style is very inclusive. I am not. You know some of the businesses I've worked in, where they're more corporate, are much more sort of top down, and you know this is the mandated approach and this is how we do it, and I actually think there's a lot of value in allowing people to flourish individually. So just because it's my idea doesn't mean it's a good idea. Sometimes I have bad ideas and having a team that is encouraged to push back and have an opinion and be transparent and be excited about their ideas and to allow them to execute their ideas even if I think it's a bad idea sometimes and allowing them to test and learn and fail and then recover and begin again. So I think trusting people, trusting your team, giving them autonomy, is really important. It's not about control, and many, many leaders make a mistake that if they control and they hang on really tightly to the strategy and the teams just execute on what they're telling them to do, that it will be successful. That doesn't work in my opinion. What works is a collaborative team, I have the added complexity of a local global trip. So my team in London is very, you know, they talk about you higher in the body of yourself, so my team come with a very similar background to me, right, which I've tried really hard to not do. But ultimately there is comfort in building a team around yourself that understand how you work and your logic. But my local teams, you know, have teams in Australia who are mainly expats who have quite good industry experience, require less time investment because they get it, they know what they're doing. In Southeast Asia we have younger teams who have less experience. So, and in our South America business, we grapple a little bit with my efficiency levels and productivity levels sometimes and my expectations are maybe slightly diverse to theirs.

Melanie Smallwood:

So the successful part is adjusting how I work and how I engage and how I communicate with every single individual in different countries. With my global team I can be super direct because I'm here, I'm with them all the time. I can say, right, this is what we're doing, this is how we're going to do it With my Asia team. That's not the right approach because they don't respond to that. They respond much better to you know. How should we think about doing this? What are your ideas? How do we get there? And it's a more you know, a slightly different strategy and it's just not one size fits all. Everybody is an individual. Everybody has different life pressure, different work pressure.

Melanie Smallwood:

I say to my leaders in my team just because you run at 100 miles an hour doesn't mean that everybody in your team can and it doesn't mean that they're not brilliant at what they do. They just operate in a different way. So we accommodate that and I'm very lucky that people leadership has been a core focus for me throughout my career because I've been very fortunate to have brilliant mentors who have guided me and taught me how to get the best out of people that I work with. And so we have a strong focus on mental health. We have a strong focus on work-life balance with my team and it builds a really successful, really high-energy, really productive team which ultimately delivers commercial results for our business, which is what is my mandate right Get the business growth. And you don't do it by mandating. This is how we're going to do it. You do it by giving people room to grow and to deliver and to be involved.

Melanie Smallwood:

So I'm always very proud that my engagement scores are the highest in our company, and that's you know not. It takes time and it's also about investment in my time, in my people. It's not just all about, you know, get me the results. It's also about what's happening in your life and what are the pressures and how can we support or how can we solve some of that stuff with you? How can we support or how can we solve some of that stuff with you?

Melanie Smallwood:

So I know from my early days, when I had my daughter back in the day, I was told be back in your office within six weeks, because if you're not, somebody else will have their feet under the table and that's not okay. It was never okay. But I think in today's world it's just a false expectation that we shouldn't have, because we work remotely. Right, I have 12 time zones and some of my team are online at 7am, so at 3pm I'm saying take, you're done for the day, take the rest of the day out, spend some time on you, because there's no need to be buns on seats for eight hours a day. It's much more flexible how people are working now and I think that lends itself to a much more positive environment for employees as well.

The Trailblazers Experience :

There's a lot of connecting the dots here of how you've described your leadership style and how you're leading teams across 12 countries, which is no small feat. But also you've found a way to understand the cultural nuances, the ways of doing businesses in different countries, the cultural variances and also the diversification of your team, whether they're parents, young, older, and it's really lovely even just to hear that that you've taken all your experience on board to help building these amazing teams who then will be open to delivering the strategy and the vision as well. So it's great to see that, because some leaders do not take all the learnings and all the pitfalls of what happened in their past experiences. They just keep on bulldozing, saying we have to do it this way, this is how it always should be done, but you are endeavoring to make it better and make it easier. I think commitment to people and being positive is also a big part of your mantra as well, in being a leader too. Is that fair to say?

Melanie Smallwood:

Yeah, and really important is to enjoy your time at work. Like there's a lot of humor. In my team we have a lot of fun times. We do, you know, pt sessions with my trainer, so there's a lot of you know. Yes, we work really hard but we also have a lot of fun and everything is done with good grace and humor. And I think as long as you have that, you get a lot more out of people and your commitment from your team is a lot greater.

Melanie Smallwood:

My team have been with me. I mean, I've been with GFG for over eight years. Most of my team have been with me for the duration, so it's also about, you know, making them feel comfortable and valued in their contribution to the business. And one really important learning for me as a leader as I was coming through the ranks, was people love taking the wins on your behalf, right. There used to be a lot of that where I would deliver something and then somebody would go, yeah. So we did this and we did that. I put my team front and center for their wins. They go in front of the chief exec, they go in front of the board, they go in front of anyone, because it's their win and it's their value creation for the business. I don't need you know. I've had a brilliant career. I love what I do. I don't have anything to prove to anybody anymore, so I want them to own the wins as well.

The Trailblazers Experience :

Yeah, and that's also just a different way of looking. I think. Just you know the ego out the door saying you're only as good as your team and letting them enjoy and relish that, because I could tell you stories as well where you've done all the work and somebody else is taking all the credit and you sort of say seriously what's going on and to allow teams to also be able to make mistakes. We all remember our first presentation and how that didn't go too well, but you got to start somewhere, isn't it? It's so key and so important as well. So talk to me about you are a successful woman in leadership. How are you championing women and empowering them as well? And you've talked about your stories of being a parent and the challenges you had about. You know you need to get in, otherwise someone else is going to fulfill that position for you. How are you inspiring and championing women within your organization or even outside of it as well?

Melanie Smallwood:

So I think my organization I'm very lucky that because it's not an industry-wide position, right we have a very broad and diverse board we have a very broad and diverse management team. The executive team is about 50-50 split between female, male, lots of different diversity, whether it's culture, educational. So I'm a big advocate of that. Internally, we're a female consumer-focused business, right. So we're 70% female in our end consumer. So we have a very strong affiliation with empowering women in our business and that you know our chief we have one chief exec who's female. We had two prior to that. So we're, I think, internally, in terms of the company, we're very good at shouting loudly about the achievements and the position that we hold. I think my team is actually all female now. It's not always been the case. My team is actually all female now, it's not always been the case, but they're all female and I champion their development and I champion their evolution as leaders and I support them with, you know, whether it's educational investments. So they not about, it's not about enabling and empowering them for my benefit, for Global Fashion Group, it's about empowering them for their future careers. So we look at it in a very different way and I think, outside of my business. I have two girls. You know home is very female focused and I have two very ambitious and feisty kids, which I'm a massive supporter of. I think having a voice is incredibly important because when I was younger I wasn't that way. So I advocate at home and there's a lot of stuff that we do at home that supports them. I think outside of the company, I do a lot of mentoring. I do a lot of advocating for next generation. You know I work with Jack Parsons from my Duvet Flip, who does a lot of work around employment for young people. You know I've done a podcast with him. I'm connected into him to see how can I, you know, can I support, can I advise, can I mentor? So I work with a lot of the fashion colleges where there's new incumbents coming through that you know are going through these fashion learnings to figure out what they want to be. So I do everything I can within my power and I dedicate a lot of time to supporting the next generation.

Melanie Smallwood:

I mean there is a very high female focus in the industry. I think we as an industry need to do more, because one really astounding thing that I saw last week on LinkedIn was a picture of an event, a fashion event, which was a brand event. They took a photo, took a group photo of the attendees and, obviously, the leaders of this particular business. 75% of the attendees were male and these are female focused fashion businesses. So I think we have to have stronger voices. What we have as women is high degrees of emotional intelligence, high degrees of intuition around who our end consumer is, and I think we have to shout louder. I think we're very as women I think and it's, you know, as women I think, and it's hard because to put yourself in a position where you say, actually, this is what I think, this is what I want, because we don't value ourselves. We don't find it as easy, in my opinion, to sit there and say I should get that board job because I'm overqualified and because I can do a brilliant job, whereas, you know, a guy will sometimes go with zero experience, go, yeah, I can do that. It's a self-belief and a confidence topic that we really need to give our female next gen the confidence to have the voice to share their opinions and their thoughts, because it's incredibly valid. And so I think the industry has to do more. They have to advocate for women in leadership roles and we also have to take responsibility that if we don't have a voice, we won't get a seat at the table.

Melanie Smallwood:

And that, for me, is a journey. You know, when I first started at GFG, I was just always quite grateful for what I was given. It's a really weird thing, right, I worked really hard, but if I got a pay rise I was like, oh well, that's nice, that's great. I would never go and ask. But actually in the last four years, my mindset changed and I'm like you know what? This is my value, this is what I need and this is what I think I deserve. But it takes confidence and it takes time. So I think it's about empowering through mentoring and sharing experiences like mine, and you know you're doing a brilliant job of sharing other women's experiences of how did they get there and what were the barriers and what are the important things. So I think encouraging the next gen to have a voice and to be confident in who they are and what they can the value they can bring is half the battle.

The Trailblazers Experience :

I mean, Melanie, you've touched on so many areas. I mean we could go on for hours in terms of what needs to be done, but, you know, what's really resonated with me is how you're actively, even through the mentorship, saying right, who are our male allies, who can help us along the journey in terms of changing that image of top senior leaders at a conference? And they're 70% male, 70% Caucasian. How do we sprinkle all the diversity and bring it up so that we have representation of everyone, male and female, different colors, ethnicities. It's so important because that's what you know, fashion, e-commerce and all these industries are made of. But the other point, about mindset and confidence is so important.

The Trailblazers Experience :

You know these toolkits of yes. If you think you deserve more, ask for it. If you have a seat at a table, represent empower, speak up. These are all things that we're not taught. You're not taught in school. If you go to business school or whatever, I don't think there's a course on that at the moment. So creating these platforms, whether it's virtually through podcasts or mentorships or other women getting together, is so important, I think, even for your daughters. You're probably seeing that as well.

Melanie Smallwood:

Absolutely, and I think we should just never stand still on that. It's never going to be perfect, but if I as an individual can contribute to some change, I'm happy, right as long as I'm doing the right things and I'm standing behind what I believe. And you know, I remember having a conversation with one of my bosses at the company, because when I joined it was very white, male dominated and he said you know, what do you, what do you think of our diversity? And I went what diversity?

The Trailblazers Experience :

What diversity. Where is it?

Melanie Smallwood:

Everyone is white, educated in the same way, has come through consulting backgrounds. You're not, you're not creating any, any value. You're just this is. You know you may as well have one, you don't need five, because they all think the same, they all articulate the same and actually group think yeah, he made change, he made significant change and he got it. He was like I get it and we're, you know, but we're diverse in our countries.

Melanie Smallwood:

I said that's just a, an effective location. You know, that's not, that's not a strategic balance, that's more an effect of where we operate right. So I think having male leaders that understand that challenge as well and see the value in, in thinking differently, changing the strategy, I think is really important. And my leadership has been, you know, very, very supportive of that and a big advocate for that, and I think I'd love to see the same quality of leader more broadly in the industry. But you know it takes a female to educate them sometimes on, you know, where they're going to deliver success. So it's never going to stop. But we have to just keep pushing and keep enabling and empowering and we'll get there in the end.

The Trailblazers Experience :

We have to keep going, that's for sure. I mean even navigating just the fashion industry and e-commerce. It's also changed as well. You know it's become very dynamic. We've seen some movers and shakers, some companies going, some brands coming. How are you staying relevant, you know, ahead of trends and adapting to just changing consumer behaviors, Because I've been seeing a lot of the consumer is still king, you know, customer is still king, but also customers are beginning to build their identity around brands or platforms that have a mission statement, that have, you know, a sustainability angle around it. That seems to be a way of, I guess, the next gen showing their identity in a way, isn't it? How are you staying abreast of all these changes that are happening, Because they are really swift? I feel like it's a lot at the moment going on, Melanie.

Melanie Smallwood:

It's a lot. I mean it's. Look, we're very. Our business is 11 years old, so we're technically a startup, albeit that we're publicly listed. So our mindset is all about agility and customer first. Our customers are in that age, that next gen, who care deeply about what they buy, where it's made, how it's made, and so very early on, I think before many businesses have even kind of began to deal with it, we built a we delivered a sustainability strategy, which is our people and planet positive first approach, where we do everything from a supply chain perspective that we can do to support our sustainability goals. To support our sustainability goals, we do everything from a science-based target perspective to deliver, you know, to minimize our impact, albeit that we know the fashion industry generally has one of the highest impacts on carbon emissions, for example. So we do a lot of innovations around, can we work with our brand partners direct from source? So can we pick up the goods from the factory in the Far East rather than allowing them to air freight to the UK and then us air freighting it back to Asia, for example. So we're doing little things.

Melanie Smallwood:

I think from a customer perspective, there's been a significant shift in the values that people hold when it comes to fashion, and our customers particularly like to shop by their values. So we implemented destinations on all of our platforms where a customer can choose how they shop. So if they only want products that resonate around animal welfare or community, they can filter by those attributes. So we're giving people options in terms of their values and ethics and how they want to consume the products that we sell. We have a private label that's fully sustainable, which is incredibly successful. It's beautiful, it's not ridiculously expensive because that can be a consequence sometimes and we work with our brand partners very closely to make sure that we're making transparent their positions around sustainability and, you know, if they have a particular position, we make sure that in our marketing, our narrative, our content on our sites, that we align with their position. So I think there are a lot of different things that we're doing.

Melanie Smallwood:

I think we do not work with fast fashion brands on principle, not because there's a commercial you know there is a huge commercial value in some instances but we have taken a position that that entry price point level that is being done by other people who I'm not going to name. We don't want to get involved in that. We don't want to be advocates for that type of consumption, which is the disposable fashion that you know. You buy something for five pounds, you wear it once and you throw it away. So as a business, we take a very strong position in that regard and we work with brands that share our values. So I think that's definitely been an evolution.

Melanie Smallwood:

We're a young business, we're agile and we're able to adapt. So we started with the Australia business, because the Australian consumer cares deeply about where their product comes from, and we delivered a considered edit in Australia probably eight years ago so way before this was even really a fashionable topic and we rolled it out in the last 18 months to every single region. So we're giving everybody the opportunity. We work where we can. We work with pre-loved. We have a lot of initiatives which help us with consumption.

Melanie Smallwood:

Residual stock is a big industry problem.

Melanie Smallwood:

You know we are very fickle in how we manage our residual stock.

Melanie Smallwood:

You know we donate a lot.

Melanie Smallwood:

We repurpose a lot.

Melanie Smallwood:

We don't follow some of the processes that others do.

Melanie Smallwood:

So I think, from a responsibility perspective, we're doing a lot.

Melanie Smallwood:

It's never going to be enough right.

Melanie Smallwood:

There's always more that we can do.

Melanie Smallwood:

And we're helping our brand partners understand, you know, how they can align more with our values, if it's not something that's front and center.

Melanie Smallwood:

So and we'll continue to do that but fundamentally, our customers are the ones that dictate how we evolve right. We listen, we learn, we read a lot about what's happening from an industry perspective and we work with 12,000 brands, so we have a lot of things in our toolkit that we can do through our brand partners and also through our private label business, where we can support that change in behavior and that change in consumer behavior, and we just keep adjusting right. It's just about learning, it's adapting and being agile and ultimately, our customer satisfaction scores are what we live by. We're 80% plus, which, for a fashion business, is super high, and that's because we're constantly adjusting our value proposition to allow the customer to shop the products that they want at the price that they want and have them delivered in a way that they want. We have sustainable packaging. We've done as much, I think, as we can do and we will continue to look at how we keep evolving that.

The Trailblazers Experience :

But it's a constant learning and it feels like Melanie from everything you've described yourself as a C-suite leader. You have intentionally aligned yourself with the business. That I think sits probably with your core values and ethics around responsible practice, how you operate with all stakeholders, your customers. You talked about your team, talking about the next gen, talking about the planet. It's all aligned in terms of you, if you've even noticed it. Your career journey into just having purpose in this role. Is that fair to say? Yeah, I care deeply about.

Melanie Smallwood:

You know I have kids and I want there to be a future for them. I want them to be able to exist and to live their best lives. And you know I don't have much control. But where I can influence, it's absolutely the right thing to do. And you know I educate them around fashion because they're consumers, avid consumers of fashion, and I'm like you know, this is, this, is a place where you do not shop because it's just not okay with me. And you know I think so there's part education and part kind of practical within my remit.

Melanie Smallwood:

How can I influence and support the journey? So it's, again, things that I care deeply about, because it's not about getting results at any cost, because ultimately, that's not a long term sustainable business. You know that's a short term quick fix and we're not. We're not in that business, in my, in my business, and none of the leaders are engaged in that thought process. It's really about long-term sustainable growth delivered in the right way, um, for our customers. So it's why, probably, I've been with the business for as long as I have, because the core values are very aligned with my personal core values. So, yeah, it's a nice thing to be able to work for a business that does advocate for the right things.

The Trailblazers Experience :

From a business perspective, Now you've talked about balancing a demanding career with personal life. You're also a mom to two amazing daughters, and we all know in this day and age, personal well-being is so important as well. How have you managed to prioritize that in whatever way, shape or form, and what does that mean to you in terms of your view on work-life balance, or just balance?

Melanie Smallwood:

Well, look, I think for the first 10 years of my career I didn't have a balance. I was on a mission to do what I wanted to do and you know, I had a family life and my kids grew up with nannies and certainly my eldest daughter, you know, jokes about it now, but it hurts when we talk about it. I'm like, why did I make that decision? But at the time, for me I felt like it was the right one. My second daughter was born she's 15, coming up 16, and I had a catastrophic injury from her birth and I was meant to go back to work very, very quickly. I was at Harvey Nichols to work very, very quickly. I was at Harvey Nichols at the time. Very quickly after her birth, I had planned to be at Paris Fashion Week. I'd booked the hotel, I'd booked a nanny to come with me to bring the kid who would have only been six weeks old or something ridiculous and I had this catastrophic injury that put me out of action for nearly three months. I mean physically couldn't stand up. That was, you know, the consequence, and I think it was at that point that I had a little bit of a moment, a bit of an epiphany, where I was like okay, you know I nearly died at this point, and so why am I compromising my life and my child's life to do this? And I think that was the turning point for me. Part of it was forced. I was not able to work for a period of time, so there was a physical challenge around how do you get back to being fully functioning? And I think what I then took away from that is investing time in my well-being and my children's well-being is more important than my job, and I love my job. It makes me who I am. It allows me to be the person that I am from a character perspective. But if somebody said to me tomorrow, choose your kids or choose your job, I'd choose my kids because I lost a lot of time with them in the early years and you don't get that back. But the artistry is in finding a balance right.

Melanie Smallwood:

So COVID, to some extent, was a really interesting time for me because my kids were used to me traveling extensively. I was never in one country for very long and it was just a way of life for them. And then suddenly I was here and I was present all the time and I had a conversation with my eldest daughter and I said, wow, this is really cool, I get to spend time with you. And she was like, yeah, you know, we'll see. And we did three months of COVID and she was like, yeah, I think I preferred it when you traveled a little bit more, because you're really in my business all the time and I think there's definitely not, from my perspective, covid and being at home five days a week and being present with just them is not the answer.

Melanie Smallwood:

But I think I work from home three days a week. I'm in the office two days a week. I still travel. I'm very present for them at sports days, at graduations, at really important moments of their life, and I prioritize that. So I have really clear boundaries with my company and if there is something that is important to them that I need to be there for, I will do that. So it's, you know again, fortunate that I work for a business that is very supportive of that balance. But they know that if they say to me, mom, I need this, I need you to be here for this, like we're doing exams next week, it's not GCSEs, but my younger daughter has big exams next week. So I'm present this week at home.

Melanie Smallwood:

I've not been in the office because she needs me to be there while she's revising, arguably only to provide snacks and diversion occasionally, but she still needs me to be present, so that's the decision I made.

Melanie Smallwood:

She still needs me to be present, so that's the decision I made.

Melanie Smallwood:

So I think you have to find a balance, and mine was forced. Mine was, you know, a physical accident that forced me to do it but I think I have brilliant relationships with my kids. You know my kids can talk to me about anything. They know they can come to me and ask anything, and I'm also very, you know, good at my job. I deliver value in my job. So, being able to manage that sometimes it's harder than others, but I found a really good way of navigating both, which make me a much happier person than I was when I was just head down working 24-7 and not really thinking about these two little kids that I decided to bring into the world. So we're in a. I think it is important to not, you know, to be able to see the wood for the trees when it comes to family, because your family are the most important thing in your life. And work is brilliant and we all love it, but if work goes away, you're just left with family, right?

The Trailblazers Experience :

so and sometimes life gives you that reset, isn't it to re reevaluate what really matters? It's great to even have this platform to even talk about and remind people just finding your why, finding what really matters, what's your purpose, what's important to you. But also, the other thing is at the beginning of all our careers, sometimes you just have to double down and just do the work. You have to turn that dial up. The work has to be done to set that foundation so that when you are that C-suite leader, that you have the space and the room to you know, maybe pick and choose what you focus on and prioritize in a different way.

Melanie Smallwood:

Yeah, and I think you know I talk about family a lot. I have some of my team that don't are not yet on that part of their journey but it's equally important for them. You know, on a Friday I advocate for take the afternoon, do something fun. Don't do yoga, don't run, whatever your passion is, because I think having having headspace to really think about you is also really important. You know you get less headspace when you've got a family because you're thinking about your kids pretty much, but it is important to take. You know I go and do spa weekends with my girlfriends and you know, go and do a fine time for me and for my team, that's really important. So you know the business will be here tomorrow me and for my team, that's really important. So you know the business will be here tomorrow.

Melanie Smallwood:

There's no, you don't have to solve everything. Today is kind of the mantra that I live by. You know, there's not, we're not, shouldn't be in such a hurry, always, I think. But that's a to your point. I didn't think like that when I started my journey. Um, I have the luxury of time and experience. That's brought me full circle too. I don't have to solve everything in a day, the priorities can overflow to the next day or the next week, and nothing catastrophic is going to change.

The Trailblazers Experience :

I mean, it just resonates for the audience If you're not watching on YouTube. Melanie's got some lovely reminders at the back of her. One of them says love, which is really important. You know, loving your family, but also loving what you do, but also life. It's just not that deep. It won't matter in five years, isn't it? Don't spend more than five minutes on it, absolutely. I have to remind myself too.

Melanie Smallwood:

Melanie as well, it's an important one so we've talked a lot about core values and ethics what are your core values is be respectful and honest and treat people the way you would like to be treated. It's a very important value that my father instilled in me very early doors. And be humble. I think, if you behave in a good, positive way and you lead by example whether it's your employees, them on the journey and you collaborate and you're, I try to inspire people, myself is really, you know, we have an expression at work which is you know, be comfortable in yourself, be your own true self at work, and I think that's really important because how I conduct myself reflects on our business, it reflects on my kids, on my kids, and so, being humble and honest and and doing the right thing, probably where I, where I invest and you know, I think putting people first fundamentally is is the way I live my life, whether it's at home or at work, and I think understanding your impact on people is really important. So, yeah, for me and you know, ethics is a very is a very important thing for me.

Melanie Smallwood:

I'm not, you know, I I don't think that there is uh, there is room for doing things at any cost. I think you have to be aware of consequences of behavior and you have to be accountable for that, and I'm not perfect. I make mistakes. But understanding that I make mistakes and being accountable and apologizing when I do is super important. So I try and live by those values and I try and instill those values in my kids. I think somewhat successfully so far. I think somewhat successfully so far. So yeah, I think just. You know, my father told me when he first started his career you know you need to treat everyone equally, whether it's the lady that's bringing a cup of tea or the cleaner, because one day that lady that's doing the cleaning or making the tea might be your boss.

The Trailblazers Experience :

You never know where people's lives end up. So I think those are good philosophies and values to live by, and also just treating people as people, isn't it? It feels like your father and my father have had cross paths as well. He would greet everyone, ask them how their day was, whether they're a cleaner, someone sweeping, always, you know, genuinely interested in them as people, as human beings.

Melanie Smallwood:

It's respect. It's respect for other people's you know, and taking and you said it taking time to speak to people not just about what I need them to do for me, but about their life and what's going on in their life at the minute is really important, because you never know right what people are going through.

The Trailblazers Experience :

And Professor Scott Galloway was. He presented at the OMR, so it's a conference in Hamburg and he just left with one message just saying ask, whether it's men or women, just ask someone, how are you, how are you really doing? Because loneliness is, you know, epidemic in itself. There are a lot of people who are lonely, a lot of people not sharing how they're feeling, a lot of people who are lonely, a lot of people not sharing how they're feeling, a lot of people not being vulnerable and just asking people, how are you, how are you really, how are you doing? Will just spark and open the conversation of people being seen and being heard and then being respected as well yeah, totally agree, I think, but it's also really important to listen.

Melanie Smallwood:

I think very often people will ask how are you? And it's a tick box exercise, and then they'll be doing something else, right, because it's not super.

The Trailblazers Experience :

Check list.

Melanie Smallwood:

Yeah, yeah, it's like check, you know I've done that in the toolkit, but I think actually taking the time to listen and understand I think is fundamental. But I think you know everybody's learning and growing and hopefully the future leaders will get it that. You know these are pretty fundamental requirements of being a good commercial leader and a good people leader.

The Trailblazers Experience :

I think, melanie, in a way you've summarized. We always come down to three trailblazer takeaway tips, but you've summarized a plethora, isn't it, of tips and takeaways for the audience to go away with. But if you were to summarize, if someone has missed the amazing beginning of the podcast and has just gone all the way to the end and said let's listen to Melanie's trailblazer takeaway tips, what would they be?

Melanie Smallwood:

Be kind, be humble and be persistent. I think those on a personal level and there are lots of other business tips, but I think being kind, know being kind, humble and persistent in your journey are really the things that are important to be successful in life.

The Trailblazers Experience :

Melanie, on that note, thank you so much for sharing your story. Being vulnerable, it's lovely to see and hear this from a different lens of the rise that you've had in your career across various sectors, industries, countries, territories and just you know, listening to you, and I've been inspired. I feel like we've led parallel lives in terms of traveling and having nannies or pairs as well, to get to where we need to go, but it's been such a great story that will definitely inspire. So thank you very much.

Melanie Smallwood:

Thank you so much for inviting me. It's been an absolute pleasure talking to you.

The Trailblazers Experience :

Amazing. So audience, this has been the Trailblazers Experience podcast. You know where to find us. We are on all streaming platforms. And just do me one favor tell another woman about the podcast, and thank you very much for joining us.

Melanie Smallwood:

Thank you.