The Trailblazers Experience Podcast

EP40 Tanya Vucetic :Crafting Simplicity in Tech An Odyssey from Finance to Blockforms

• Ntola • Season 3 • Episode 40

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Tanya Vucetic, founder and CEO of Blockforms, shares her career journey and insights on building a successful tech business. She discusses the importance of identifying core values and finding work-life balance. Tanya also highlights the challenges faced by women in the tech industry and the need for more representation. She emphasizes the value of mentorship and the importance of taking risks and overcoming imposter syndrome. Tanya's story serves as an inspiration for aspiring entrepreneurs and women in tech. In this conversation, Tanya Vucetic shares her insights on mentorship, learning opportunities, and the importance of not defining oneself solely by their job or career.

When Tanya took the leap from financial analyst to the forefront of tech entrepreneurship, little did she know that her journey would be a blueprint for innovation in form automation. Accompany us on a riveting exploration of Tanya's voyage from the world of finance to the inception of Blockforms, a venture that showcases her genius in simplifying the once arduous task of form-filling across various sectors. Her story is infused with insights on how the relentless march of time management has become indispensable in today's work dynamic, and her foray into tech was inspired by the allure of flexibility and the burgeoning field of data science back in 2018.

The landscape of technology is ever-changing, and so are the soft skills necessary to navigate it—This episode peels back the layers of scaling a software business, highlighting the agility required to evolve with customer needs while balancing the technical advancements and investment it demands. As we unpack the significance of diversity in tech and the underrepresentation of women in the field, our discussion illuminates the often overlooked yet crucial skills of communication and active listening—skills that fuel innovation and leadership
Takeaways
Identify your core values and prioritize work-life balance.
Embrace challenges and overcome imposter syndrome.
Seek mentorship and surround yourself with supportive networks.
Take calculated risks and believe in your ideas. Mentorship is crucial for personal and professional growth. Seek out mentors who can provide guidance and expertise in areas where you lack skills.
Put yourself in environments where you can learn and grow. Be open to new experiences and actively listen to those around you.
Have aspirations for the future and be adaptable to change. Don't be afraid to pursue new paths and explore different career opportunities.
Remember that your job does not define your identity. Focus on what truly matters to you and create a life that aligns with your values.

Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Early Career Journey
04:12 Identifying Core Values and Career Shift
07:28 Co-founding Blockforms
10:19 The Challenges of Building a Business
17:24 Exciting Trends in the Tech Space
22:21 Evolution of Leadership Skills
29:06 Work-Life Balance and Self-Care
33:05 Empowering Women in Tech
39:16 Overcoming Challenges and Imposter Syndrome
44:29 Fundraising and Scaling
46:00 The Importance of Self-Awareness and Taking Risks
47:17 Advice for Entrepreneurs and the Value of Mentorship
48:18 The Importance of Mentorship
51:23 Humble Beginnings and Learning Opportunities
52:03 Aspirations for the Future
52:32 Trailblazer Takeaway Tips
54:33 Your Job is Not Your Identity

Find Tanya :
 

Listen : to the audio version Apple Spotify .Amazon Music Google Podcasts
Watch and subscribe to my YouTube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@Thetrailblazersexperience
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The Trailblazers experience :

So welcome to another episode of the Trailblazers Experience podcast, where we have candid conversations with women sharing their career journeys, and my next guest is Tanya. She has an amazing record, diverse work experience spanning multiple industries and sectors, and she's currently the founder and CEO of Blockforms. Welcome, tanya, how are you?

Tanya Vucetic :

I'm well. Thank you, and thank you for having me here today. I'm looking forward to our conversation.

The Trailblazers experience :

Really exciting, and let's really just take it all the way back and just start about your early years and your career journey, of sort of what's led you to where you are now. You started off as a financial analyst, but you know what made you decide at some point to go in that direction.

Tanya Vucetic :

Sure. Well, when you're young and the roadmap is clear and you're told get good grades, be hard, pick something that will lend itself to a good job. I dove deep into the most difficult well, seemingly most difficult thing in school, being mathematics and then studying economics. And after graduating from university it's quite hard to substantiate to an employer who's hiring me. I don't have any skills, but I got good grades and I was waitressing on the side looking for internships, doing all the things a typical student does in this day and age, and the first job that had me is the direction my career went in, and that was in finance for a media company, and I learned a lot of practical skills at that time.

Tanya Vucetic :

Excel they actually call the terminology, you know, an Excel jockey, someone who doesn't even touch the mouse and is doing all of the analysis. And I was looking I wasn't even looking for a change, but I was scooped up by a recruiter and it was an interesting experience when you're so young to be pursued for from another employer and found myself subsequently going into aviation finance and doing the valuation of commercial aircraft for a lease, purchase and sale, and I fell in love with that job because it was so international and I was born and raised in the US but my mother's from Mexico, my father's from Serbia. This job really mirrored who I felt I was in my early 20s, just getting to see quotes coming in and corresponding with people all over the globe. So that is up until that point and I eventually, again sticking to the roadmap of a student, really diligent young lady, I was like, okay, now it's time for graduate school.

Tanya Vucetic :

And I applied to graduate school and at that point in time had two paths I could have taken and one was to do school part time and stay with my employer or go on a total adventure. So I was very fortunate to have the option and I opted for an adventure, sold everything that I owned and moved to Hong Kong to get my MBA and further discover my values, who I am. And it was a life changing experience to have to adapt to a new culture. In the US we fancy ourselves very especially in California, very diverse and open minded, but it's a whole nother animal to be on someone else's turf and have to adapt how you behave and learn different customs. So I mean we can go any direction with this conversation from here.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, I mean what I'm hearing here is a takeaway. Is there's something to be said? Is you know, you go to school and you take a certain it's a clear path. You study a few subjects, modules, but then it's that opening of space of when you leave school, of what do I do now, and it feels like for you the. You love numbers, you're very analytical and but on the other hand, you also enjoy working with different cultures. You talked about when you moved to Hong Kong, that there was something about discovering who you were and your core values. What were your core values at that time and have they changed and evolved over the years?

Tanya Vucetic :

I love this question because I don't think that they changed. I think I just identified them. So I knew that being in a career that made me feel smart was important, and that's why I wanted to do something hard and that's why I went into numbers, and that is something I accomplished and that meeting to prove myself to myself or the world, however I, I'm going to move past that with maturity and accomplishment. But something that remains extremely important to me and was at the time, was the global aspect of my role, and the thing that I discovered and is a huge value to me is the sense of freedom, of being able to work from anywhere and manage my own schedule, and the people that I'm working with don't care if I'm sitting in an office in Los Angeles. I can be in Peru, I can be in India, and as long as I have the agency to manage my own schedule, I am happy. So that's actually why I got into tech, because these technical roles are most commonly remote, so that's what inspired me to learn how to code and and get into data science.

Tanya Vucetic :

Additionally, how many years ago? No, 2018. That's when data science was emerging and popular as a term and very sexy, so I definitely gravitated to that, that buzzword of a career at the time, which is which is now exploding with the popularly available models like GPT and and Lama and Claude, so in general in AI at whole. So yeah, during my time in Hong Kong, I really fortified, discovered and have continued to fortify that requirement of a freedom and having the ability to manage my own biggest resource being time.

The Trailblazers experience :

That's amazing and I think a really good takeaway there about time management, isn't it the fact that you know you can work globally and remote or hybrid, and the the main outcome is really getting the job done. How you do it, where you do it, is actually relevant. It's can you get the job done.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, yes.

The Trailblazers experience :

And talk to me about co-founding block forms, because a what is block forms and what has been that journey to becoming your own CEO of your own business?

Tanya Vucetic :

Happy to so in. I was at an interesting crossroads in 2018, and I was already working remotely before the digital nomad lifestyle became popular with COVID and I what had some insecurity around not having a formal degree to be a data scientist. So I was really creative and, with my network, was able to achieve getting a data science job. But simultaneously I was thinking, oh, I really need, I need that credential. So I enrolled in, I applied and was accepted to Georgia Tech's computational analytics program and simultaneously had this consulting job where I could work anywhere in the world. And then I had the opportunity to start block forms with, at the time, three other co, -founders, and I was really open to opportunity. At the time, I said I'm going to just try a few things and see what sticks. And, as you might expect, what I signed up for was way too much and I had the realization that I'm already a data scientist. Why am I going to school again? Like there's this, like addiction to the, to the certificate, and I'm like, no, I need to stop spending money and investing my time in school. I've done it, I've paid my dues and block forms became a vision that has persisted since end of 2018.

Tanya Vucetic :

And block to describe block forms. It's a software that automates forms. So any application that you fill out online in the form of a work doc, you are filling out one digital form but populating as many applications as you need to. So this is an extremely useful tool for any business that fills out a ton of paperwork. So insurance, finance, staffing agencies, real estate we take any forms and consolidate them into one digital form, but the real secret sauce is that you're actually populating the original forms. So that's what block forms is, and it's an extremely robust solution that's taken time to build and we're actually in an exciting place that now it's time to scale.

The Trailblazers experience :

That's awesome. I mean, that's really amazing to see that you finding a problem and then trying to solve it and then turning it into a business is sort of that magic three, yeah, and I love the fact that you've been very honest that this journey started in 2018 and there've probably been several iterations of the business and upgrading it and then using data really to say, okay, what does the customer really need and how to adopt it. That's amazing. I mean kudos to you.

Tanya Vucetic :

Thank you. That's precisely the process, and I think that there's a lot of clickbait out there and social media outside hustles and we see all these million zillion dollar investments and startups, and truth is those are rare and building a business requires a lot of patience. It takes a lot of self reflection and it takes really putting your ego aside and ditching what doesn't work and trying different things along the way. You hear the term startup, but many of them out there are 10, 15 years old and they're still in the startup phase, especially software, because technology changes so quickly and you need to adapt to the customer needs and, with so many technology options, there's a lot of playing nice with different providers out there and having to integrate to really give the customers a great experience, and this requires time, money, resources, talent, patience. So it's been a long, rewarding road and it's still only the beginning.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, and do you think you're at the point where you think investment is important for you, or would you, rather than, just continue to try and scale on your own?

Tanya Vucetic :

Yeah, it's definitely important for us because we are having and that is the exciting part about doing podcasts and and putting platforms on the map Money is definitely required for us to hire and we have been going slowly and and we have customers. But in order to Hyper scale, we need more resources to do the technological advancements and on to expedite onboarding and achieve that scale without. We just need to the investment to automate everything right.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, yeah, and I mean you've talked about tech itself and I was reading a McKenzie report that they just talk about the disparities, about a how many women actually study science and engineering and science and technology and engineering degrees. It's about, I think. What does it say? 52% of women are and they're finding it challenging. So the fact that you have been to university study but also said I'm interested in data and paying the way forward, I think is really important as well.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, I. I mean, this is such a the why behind what you've just brought up. I I don't know. I think partially it's it's cultural. I mean there are different cultures where women do pursue, and that's in sciences, popularly, for example. It's not surprising to see a woman with an Eastern European last name in the tech field. Or there's also many women in India or China that pursue these, these technical degrees. Why? Why the rest of the? We see less representation of women in the rest of the world. I don't know. The answer, however, that is it fuels the disparity in the representation in the workplace.

Tanya Vucetic :

I had this consulting job. I worked for a consulting firm. I wasn't looking for gigs on my own and of all of the technical employees, there were approximately 400. Only four were women and it was out of this world to arrive at a company function to celebrate the success of the year and see that reality in practice, because we're all remote, so we don't really. It doesn't even feel like you're part of a company. So they created this event for us to feel like a team and celebrate our successes and it was like what is what? How it? Just with women being the majority population of the world, how is it possible that there we are, 1% of the technical team in this business, especially when it's remote, because you know actually more flexibility and more opportunity.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, yeah, that's so interesting.

Tanya Vucetic :

And I can speculate as as to why, but I don't know. I can talk about my own experiences and I'm sure that I've had assumptions made about me or a loss of opportunity because of my gender, but no one has ever been so bold to say this is why, but I've also had the opposite experience, where they are eager to bring a woman on the team and eager to bring the different perspective.

Tanya Vucetic :

And I think it's all especially in this day and age of automation and if I have any advice for people looking to get into technical careers, the, the, the human aspect matters so much. There are so many people with just the skills out there, but if you can communicate effectively and by communicate I mean listen effectively the biggest part of communication is people often forget is the listening component. So if you're a good listener and make the investment in your teammates and getting to know them and that is the differentiator for me when I'm hiring or managing a team versus can they code? Are they smart? And I think that's that's what really sets one resource apart from another the team aspect.

The Trailblazers experience :

It's a soft skills as well, isn't it? And especially since technology now underpins everything and innovation and growth that is happening globally. In order for you to innovate, you have to be, like you said, an active listener and being able to dissect the problem and say, okay, how can we solve this? And what are actually? People are telling me? So, so much has evolved. You've seen the field evolve so much that you decided to start your own business, but what trends are you excited about that you're seeing currently in the tech space?

Tanya Vucetic :

I think generative AI and, for listeners that aren't familiar with the term, the difference between traditional AI, where banks can detect possible fraud, or Amazon can predict what you wanna purchase next, generative AI is the generation of content that wasn't previously existing, so whether that's text or images. So generative AI is really exciting because it is a productivity enhancement, it's not a replacement. So instead of starting from scratch, even if you're writing a blog, the generative AI can create a template for you, can inspire ideas. I personally don't believe that it will out-creative human beings. I think it just makes people open to using the technology even more productive.

Tanya Vucetic :

So something I always say is generative AI is not gonna take your job, just like computers didn't and the internet didn't. It's going to well. First, people who learn to use generative AI well are going to be very competitive. So don't hesitate to start. Learn how to use this technology to give yourself an edge, and eventually that will be commonplace and I just lost my train of thought on what I was saying before that. So don't hesitate to get started. Oh, but also generative AI, similar to computers, the internet, it's going to create jobs that we haven't even.

The Trailblazers experience :

That we didn't have, that we haven't even thought about yet Exactly exactly.

Tanya Vucetic :

So just stay tuned and keep your skills up to date. I think that is a very different experience that our generation is having relative to our parents and grandparents. They picked a career and they advanced in a very linear way, and now we're being required to update our skills constantly. The same way that accountants have to keep passing their exams and real estate agents have to keep updating their licenses, or what have you Now this is required by everybody.

The Trailblazers experience :

I totally agree. I mean the fact that there are online courses and certificates, and I mean YouTube. There is no excuse for you to actually keep absorbing and soaking up all the data and knowledge that you can, and some of them are so. In terms of the way the modules are taught, it's really interactive, and you don't even know that you've actually picked up the skill set as well. We had a session it was actually for my team where they're just updating them on GA4. And the guy who was doing it he was so relaxed and delivered the session in a way that, even if you'd never had anything to do with Google Analytics or any analytics tool, you could immediately immerse yourself in it. So he made it in small, digestible, easy chunks and his videos are on YouTube and things like that. So it's being able to constantly evolve, isn't it, with the time and the technology that's out there.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, I mean if you can teach yourself how to use Instagram's new updates when they push out all these new templates and whatever. Whatever you can teach yourself how to to you agree, prompt a large language model and adapt your prompts to elicit the output that you need. You know it's. If you apply that willingness to learn one software, why not apply that to you? Know something that's business oriented or even day to day? It's such a practical, helpful technology.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, let's talk about your leadership skills, because obviously you've held several positions in the data science space. Share some insights about how leadership is evolving for you and what do you think makes an effective leader.

Tanya Vucetic :

Sure, leadership is constantly evolving for me as I am awarded the opportunity to be a leader for different groups. I think leaders need to adapt to the group that they're leading and I have had the good fortune of experiencing and learning the needs of different teams. So my leadership role was made official for the first time when I was working in Hong Kong and I supervised a team of approximately 20 people and I would say the majority of the 20 people were local to Hong Kong and that was a very, very challenging, rewarding experience for me because completely different office lifestyle communication and I made a lot of mistakes and had to swallow a hard pill and I got feedback, but it's really propelled my ability to continuously observe and receive feedback along the way. My style is not a micromanager and I think it's very important to when someone's not performing or under delivering or not meeting expectations or said they were going to do something and they haven't done so yet. It's important to be concise and clear in communicating the outcome, but also gentle, and I always ask myself before I communicate with my team okay, what do I want out of this communication?

Tanya Vucetic :

What is my objective in this conversation? Is my objective to just inform them or is my objective to motivate them? Is my objective to inspire them Because that conversation changes based on the desired outcome and nine times out of 10, my goal is to inspire them because I enjoy working with them. They're already on the team and it has happened where I'm not going to be able to communicate with them, and it has happened where the conversation went from inspiring and motivating to this isn't working out, which is a very difficult conversation, but you have to have it. But that's the long answer to your question.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, I think as a leader, you're always or as a human being, you're always trying to see the best in people, isn't it? And ultimately, whether it's a personal, professional relationship, you're always thinking, ok, what do we both want to get out of this? And if it's not working, it's a different conversation. If it's working, ok, how can we fuel this amazing conversation, or working relationship, or personal relationship? So it's an interesting balance, I think, and I think probably the way our parents grew up, it was very authoritative. Leadership styles have evolved. When they talk about leadership styles, you now have collaborative leadership style, communicative, you know, someone who's democratic.

The Trailblazers experience :

I don't think all those terminologies existed before because maybe because of the type of work environment it was. You know, if you're working in the Ford manufacturing company then there's a certain way that a business has to run and if one wheel falls off then you have to evolve and change. But I think now, like you said, with the freedom to work in different ways, remotely in tech, has just brought on a different way of how you manage people and different skill sets at different times.

Tanya Vucetic :

True, and especially highly skilled people that are difficult to coerce to join your team. I've been on both sides of the equation where I've worked for a startup and they assumed that I had the same passion around their business as they do, and it's important for founders. Anyone who's listening as a founder, anyone who works for you, is not going to have the same emotion attached to your business as you do, so I think that's an important so do you think? Assumption is it? It is. It's made. A lot of people think you know I care about this thing, so surely this person cares about the same things because everyone thinks the same way I do? Of course not, right?

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, I've seen a lot of brands as well in businesses that there's a strong focus on and rightly so on their core values, their passions, their culture, etc. And I think it's one part of the job, but also I think another important part of the job is some people just want the transactional piece of right. I can do the job, what am I getting for it, and that's all that I'm interested in. I'll be as passionate about the task Once it's completed. That's it, and you need those people as well. You know you don't need everyone who's interested in the after-work activities that are going on. You need balance. I think that's the most important thing.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, and the people who aren't drinking the company Kool-Aid and making it their life should not be valued less than the people who are really on that train. Right, I actually have a friend that the company he works for was acquired. You know, they were a small team, something like 50 people, and then they were acquired by a business that is 20,000. And that business is like we are family, we are family. And he's like oh, come on, man, like we're 20,000% family.

The Trailblazers experience :

What are you talking about? You just need a number, that's all. You want Number 10, something, something. Yes, totally.

Tanya Vucetic :

And it's okay to call a spade a spade and whittle down that, that family-ness, to the team level or the department level or the regional level, but let's not push it too far.

The Trailblazers experience :

Exactly. Let's not make it something that it actually isn't at all. It's it Exactly. Talk to me about work-life balance and you know you're someone who's traveled a lot. You worked in different, for different businesses, different roles. What does that mean to you?

Tanya Vucetic :

Work-life balance. It's really identifying the things that refuel you, and it's been an important lesson for me to learn, as for a long time, I've had my business block forms and working another job, so really two jobs and it's important. It was an important thing for me to learn that rest is productive and time with my supportive friends is productive, because that gives me fuel, that gives me energy. So, in order to achieve work-life balance, do the things that make you feel well, whether that's prioritizing exercise or time with people that you love, or a meditation practice or picking up an excellent book. You have to do those things in order to achieve work-life balance.

The Trailblazers experience :

I totally agree. I mean, we see, with the onset of devices and tech that are, you know, that monitor our REM you know was it called rapid eye movement when you're sleeping to a hoard of thought that we'd come to that stage. But I think the fact that people can see it documented the data once again coming back to data informing how lack of sleep or stress or anxiety have an impact on your daily lifestyle is really key and the reason why I always ask you know what does work-life balance mean to you? There is no one-size-fits-all and it's really important to identify what drives you, what empowers you and what keeps you going, and you know whether it's a book, whether it's just taking a walk, whatever it is that gets you back to you and is really key.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, yes, I mean when I have those moments where I have to get this thing done but no matter how hard I attempt to achieve that task, I'm unsuccessful and I just need to put it down and walk away and let my mind, brain, whatever recalibrate so that I can do that task effectively. I don't think the most successful people in the world are more successful because they don't sleep and all they do is work. I think they're using what resources are available to them, whether it's network, money, whatever. There's a lot of things that you can amplify your impact and achieve your goals. Running yourself into the ground won't make you more successful.

The Trailblazers experience :

It's not one of them, yeah, bye guys.

Tanya Vucetic :

I love you guys, so it's an important question. Yeah, definitely.

The Trailblazers experience :

And there's something to be said about I don't know if you've had the same as well is your most creative ideas come when you're actually not doing the task itself at hand. You know your life of eureka moments come when you're actively doing something else.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, I mean. That's why they say, like those shower thoughts, or you know, and you're on a, it's so important to be bored. If you're always occupied with work, or even, you know, mindlessly scrolling on social media or reading the news or watching TV, there's no room for inspiration. So, 100%, you need to let your mind go blank.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, yeah, so we know we've. You know we've talked about the gender diversity in in tech and how you know you've seen a business where there are 400 people but 1% are women. What advice can you know, can we give, and power to women who are entering or advancing in this area, in this sector? There were like a few tips, things that you wish you know. Another another lady or woman told you when you were coming up as well.

Tanya Vucetic :

Oh, wow. It's. Perhaps one of the reasons we don't see many women in this, in this field, is because that's the reality of the demographics in these roles and if you be brave, many of the people who advance my career are men, and men toward me are men. It's not you know one or the other. If you, if you walk the walk and go for it, that gives other women the permission and confidence to do so as well. And when you do advance, bring other women along, do things like any mentorship things you can do.

Tanya Vucetic :

One thing I've done with a friend is create a camp for what little girls in middle school data camp to learn data practices and and just learn that data is cool. Data is YouTube, data is Spotify, data is shopping algorithms. You can be involved in really sexy businesses on the data side and really be in the know and understanding how they're selling. And everyone says data is the new currency. So we still need a lot of parents, pioneers, to increase representation. And don't be afraid, there are many incredible men out there that will support you as well and you bring women along.

The Trailblazers experience :

There is definitely power in the park. Talk to me about the camp that you organized. Is it in the summer camp? Yes, it's a summer camp. That's a really great project.

Tanya Vucetic :

It's a really elementary level of understanding, like how do you collect data, how do you normalize data? So things like the height of blades of grass, and and making sure you're measuring in the same metric. You know, centimeters instead of inches, and and in order to compare data to data, they have to be the same same metric. And what do you do when you have data that doesn't have, that isn't the same metric? You have to convert it and this is a and just making it fun. Getting outside and and the way that we also inspire young women is by leading by example, so bringing in other women that are successful and interesting and fun and have these really cool lives, because you can have an incredible life and and still be feminine and beautiful, and even though you're pursuing a career in math. So that's what the camp is all about. It's like showing the world of possibility if you go this direction.

The Trailblazers experience :

Oh, that's amazing.

Tanya Vucetic :

And what sort of the age group that you look after in the camp Middle school, so middle school, entering high school, and what that means in the US is ages 12 to 15.

The Trailblazers experience :

And that's really that age of discovery and evolution, isn't it? It's like, if you can get them there interested, oh my God, amazing.

Tanya Vucetic :

It all boils down to having the right teachers. Math math is such a it is a challenging subject that that makes your brain have to learn discipline and observe patterns. It's not for everyone. I'm not saying everyone should force themselves in this direction. There's absolutely a lot of success to be achieved in other domains. But if you are good at math and are a woman, please, please, please, please continue.

The Trailblazers experience :

I think that are out there, isn't it Beyond just learning the Pythagoras theorem? I think that's basically it.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, I mean, it's so important to pick up your and this includes sciences. We all know how to use our phone, but how does our phone work? What is it made of? What powers it? And let's move beyond creating videos on YouTube. But, like, how does YouTube work? What platform is it sitting on? What's the architecture that that powers YouTube, that makes it accessible to every human being? With internet and a device in the world, that that? Those are the kinds of questions that I want to inspire, and then that's where the, the learning and the creativity of. Okay, now I know how this works. What else could I build that is in the. It uses similar architectures to then, and instead of oh, I have this idea, now I have to go find a developer. Well, what if you? What if you had the tools to get started on your own? And that, and that is a big part of how my business was born, with my partners.

The Trailblazers experience :

That that is such a great way to think about it. I mean, there's a research that the Harvard business review did about talking about building networks. We all talk about networking when we're older, but building networks, connecting the dots, you're starting that through the camp, where you know there's a, there's a bunch of young, young middle school teams in the phase getting to think differently, to collaborate, to explore and just developing that skill set to say, actually, how do I use this for a molder? So that's so great. We'll definitely put that in the show notes so people can learn about the camp. For even if it's in a small stage, it has to start small somewhere and you're empowering as you go along.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, that's, that's the entire purpose.

The Trailblazers experience :

So I've talked about a lot of things your, your career and what you're doing now. What other awesome challenges that you've personally faced, Tanya, as a woman, and how have you overcome them?

Tanya Vucetic :

Certainly A lot of it is imposter syndrome and thinking that who do? I think I am to go and ask investors for money and let me tell you, asking for money is awful. It is not fun to beg and say, please believe in me and any. But then something after doing it enough times and when you have a really great product and you have customers that have validated that this is a need that they, that they are willing to pay for, then something happens to your confidence and you can. You can stand up there with certainty that you've achieved up to this point with these resources and imagine how much more you can achieve with investment. And then telling that story gets a lot easier and it's. It's just believing in yourself is so hard, and I don't.

Tanya Vucetic :

I don't want to get into why that is notoriously more difficult for women, but I would encourage everyone to put themselves out of their comfort zone and if you're interested in starting your own business, you know, don't, don't plan it to death, don't write your business plan for ten years. Just start. Just start, get going and Throw things at the wall and see what sticks. So I definitely had to get over a lot of imposter syndrome and public speaking. Oh my goodness, that's it. That takes a lot of practice to not sit in and Presentation situation or interview situation not say, or even learning how you pronounce things such that it's not like for I don't know if the listeners have noticed that I hiss on my S's and I need to to practice not to hiss, to just make it easier to listen to.

Tanya Vucetic :

So it's a lot of self-awareness, uh, moving past doubt, and when you doubt yourself, do it anyways. And if you think it's silly, do it ten times more. That's that's the way to overcome Many, many of the hurdles in building a business, whether it's just at the beginning or you're starting to hire people and feeling nervous about getting them to rally behind your vision. Just just do it. And, and the big thing, and also I actually really recommend In a form of mentorship or working at a startup, because when you see how it's done there, it's very easy to pause and go. They can do it, I can do it. Yeah, just expose yourself to your dream, really expose yourself.

The Trailblazers experience :

A very good thing to look at, and you know you've talked about having a high, developing a high level of self-awareness is scary, because then you have to sort of like peel all the layers isn't it Exposed? And determine Okay, these are my strengths, let me roll with this, these are my weaknesses, let me work with them, and Ultimately, we've got nothing to lose, isn't it if you, if there's there's only this one life, there's only this one opportunity, and you hit the nail on the head. Just talking about Even asking for money, or trying to raise money, or public speaking, or talking about your business, it's, it's all these things that you're having to battle with, but the motto of just do it, just go for it, what's the worst that can happen, this is a really good one.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, I mean there's. If you don't do it, the answer is still no, so might as well, so do it. And and what if you get a yes? At some point, everyone tells when you go out for fundraising, it's really easy to get a no, it's really hard to get a yes, and even the best ideas that I? I went to one talk in Northern California and the woman sitting on stage is a very famous investor and she even has to live with the fact that she passed on Twitter 20, you know, however, many years ago, and she said no to them.

Tanya Vucetic :

And look at the business now. So it's all about. It's all about it. Keep going, keep going. If the only time it's a failure is when you give up and when. And I say keep going with a caveat take feedback, adapt, pivot what necessary, be open to learning, be humble. I know that there are those CEOs out there that think they walk on water. Don't be that one. And even they didn't know. Face everyone. The truth is, we're all out here, not knowing what we're doing and doing our best.

The Trailblazers experience :

That is so true, and you know the thing about Keep going, you, if the idea isn't working, drop it. You know, find another idea. That concept might not be it, that path Not be the journey that you need to take. So I think, yeah, he said, growth is not linear, progression is not linear. So enjoying those ebbs and flows is is really important. What stage are you in your, in your fundraising? Have you? Have you read?

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, thank you for asking. We are looking for our first institutional round right now. So previously we funded ourselves, and then we did friends and family through equity crowdfunding, and now we're launching the institutional seed round for our business to to. We've really bootstrapped this thing and Now it's time to scale. Oh, that's amazing a billion dollars.

The Trailblazers experience :

Once you get past that family and friends stage, you know it's great somewhere, isn't it?

Tanya Vucetic :

So yes, and even that I take any family or friends investment very seriously because there's over my dead body. Am I going back to them saying, well, um, it didn't work out. I have to figure it out. Especially like that, that is an even bigger motivator that people that I love believed in me.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, do you think there was like a stage, so obviously you were self-funded before that? You then said okay, I think this has got legs. This is the time now to start asking.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, and that's with when you have paying customers.

The Trailblazers experience :

Exactly, or you can pay yourself as well.

Tanya Vucetic :

Oh, yes, not yet. No, that's why I Soon that won't be the case, but that's why I've still had a job at this Up until this point, and I like to tell investors if I've accomplished this while still having a full-time job. Imagine what I could accomplish if this is all I were working on.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, so yeah, and Tanya, that's also another you know good nugget to share. You know you are an entrepreneur, but it's okay to work as well. Do not give up your day job until you know the time now to move on to the dream. The dream becomes the job.

The Trailblazers experience :

It's really important, yeah it's, I think sometimes, do you know what really annoys me, sometimes, tanya's, when I see all those ads on YouTube, on Instagram, telling us you could be making this amount just start this business just. And the reality is, you know, there is no One one tip. Wonder out there, you actually have to. If you have a business, an idea, it takes time to build and before it starts scaling.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, and many of us don't have enough in savings or a Partner that's wealthy or parents that support us In our day-to-day expenses. So I had to. I had to work a lot and really hard and, and oh, you should be proud of yourself, tanya, thank you. And If you really believe in your idea, I start validating it now and do it on the side and do what you have to do to feel safe and calculate. The risk is calculated. You don't just quit everything and go for it. You know, I live in Los Angeles. There's a lot of dreamers here and a big part of artists going full time is they know people like their art. So it's the same with building a tech business. It takes a long time to get your name out there and get a product that works reliably into production and takes a lot of patience and grit.

The Trailblazers experience :

Let's talk about mentorship. So you've talked about how mentorship has been important to you. Do you currently have a mentor, or are they role models that you just look up to in the industry that have played a role in your growth and development?

Tanya Vucetic :

Life is funny, you know, when you're ready to learn, the teacher appears, and that continues to be true. It's actually my yoga teacher who says that, but it's so true in the form of friends and network, and my business is part of an accelerator program with wonderful mentors, and the mentors change over years. So recently I was connected with a first mentor and now they're going to be joining my business, and so mentorship is something that I proactively keep in place, especially where I know I don't have that skill set. So for me, that's marketing, that's sales, that's, yeah, predominant at the moment.

Tanya Vucetic :

I'm not the best storyteller and I'm not a designer, so I know that that's where I need outside expertise and guidance. When I sit with a creative that works with businesses, they'll make some suggestions and, of course, I'm like I like this, I don't like this, but I always say well, you're the expert, what do you think? So, yes, mentors are important. How do you find them and put yourself in the environment where you're dreaming to grow into, whether that's joining a startup, or say you have aspirations to be a film producer, start small as an intern and just be ready and hungry and eager to learn and a great listener. And it's amazing, when you don't speak, how much you can learn.

The Trailblazers experience :

Oh yeah, that's a very big one. Yeah, Clean those ears. Active listening is a big thing for sure.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, and check your ego at the door. You don't know everything.

The Trailblazers experience :

And that's forever. We're forever learning. That isn't it. I mean, the amount of things I learn, even from my younger team or even my children. It's so much. Just be a sponge, just being open to explore and to learn and to learn from other people, I think is a very big thing. And the fact that you said, insert yourself in the environment you actually want to be in. You're going to have to humble yourself once you get there, because you're learning from those who are doing the do.

Tanya Vucetic :

Yes, and some of my most successful friends. A good friend of mine is an entrepreneur in the US. He graduated from UCLA with two degrees neuroscience and economics in three years, which is extremely impressive. Then he went to Dubai and was serving coffee around these billionaires. You know, whatever it takes if you're hungry, you know.

The Trailblazers experience :

Yeah, yeah. So, as you continue your journey, what are your aspirations for the future, both professionally, and where is this going for? Tanya?

Tanya Vucetic :

Oh, I would really love for this business to grow and sell it, and I, you know everyone's life is short. Life is short, life is long. I don't have to be in tech forever. I would love to go into education and do education research, especially around motivating young girls to pursue careers in math and science and understanding the why and then creating a solution to increase confidence and create environments that inspire women to pursue these careers. Girls, then women.

The Trailblazers experience :

That's amazing. We're now onto trailblazer takeaway tips. So you've shared your journey, your story, your nuggets. What are three things? That can be four, but three things you'd love to share as your trailblazer takeaway tips.

Tanya Vucetic :

Oh goodness, don't be fooled by all this social media. We touched on it earlier, but this you know success is overnight. Success is not even in a year. Success is not even in five years. Be patient, be patient, and so one is patience. Number two is be adaptable.

Tanya Vucetic :

So, whether it's feedback you're getting or new technology, or you know, if you're someone who's climbing the corporate ladder, something that happens and really has ruffled my feathers more than once is businesses getting acquired All of a sudden. That job that you love changes and you have to be adaptable. You're working with different teams. And I think the third one don't take yourself so seriously. Like, really focus on the things that recharge you, what your value system is, and create a life that mirrors your value system, because you get this one life to do these interesting things and just go for it. Your job, your career, whatever you do to earn money, is not who you are, and so that job can change. You know you can. You could have had a technical career your whole life and you suppressed your desire to write. Start writing, whatever your situation is. Your identity is not your job or your career.

The Trailblazers experience :

Tania, thank you so much. You have a really high emotional intelligence. I'm very humbled by this conversation that we've had and I'm certain it will inspire it's inspiring me right now. I need to go take stock of my value. You know things that matter to me and my priorities, but sometimes that's what you need, isn't it? That sense check, that self check, and it's great to see women in tech, and that's what we need to see more of. Thank you so much.

Tanya Vucetic :

Thank you, it was such a pleasure to have this conversation.

The Trailblazers experience :

Awesome. Well, everyone, it's been the Trailblazers Experience podcast. You know where to find us. We'll put all the important details about Tania, our amazing guest, in the show notes and Tania, the woman about a podcast. And thank you very much.